Niacinamide and Vitamin C. Note! You know, I'll trust a cosmetic chemist (Stephen) more than this girl who can't even respond to solid arguments in the comments on her own blog. So unlike alpha- and beta-hydroxy acids, L-ascorbic acid (vitamin C) and retinoids, it is non-acidic and non-irritating. The low pH of the vit C causes the niacinamide to turn into niacin which flushes the skin. It's the Ascorbic Acid form of Vitamin C (which is the "pure" form) that doesn't mix well with Niacinamide. — so I’ve been looking for a replacement ever since. Second, what about all existing skincare products that combine niacinamide and vitamin C (please see the comment section at Futurederm for examples). ReddIt “You may pick a hyaluronic acid product with skincare stars like vitamin C or niacinamide for plump skin, but without parabens, sulfates, alcohol, and other irritating ingredients,” says Dr. Sonia Batra, a dermatologist, and co-host of The Doctors. I used the famous Skinceuticals CE Ferulic for a short time a few years ago and had great results with it evening out pigmentation, but I couldn’t deal with the price tag — $166 for one ounce! Today, vitamin B3 has a wide range of medical uses. Sodium ascorbyl phosphate is approximately twice as effective as L-ascorbic acid, the most commonly used form if Vitamin C used in skin care, which is not utilized as well by the skin. However, Niacinamide can minimise the benefits of Vitamin C when applied together. Prudvi Kaka, chief scientific officer at Deciem, told R29: "Niacinamide has the potential to affect the integrity of vitamin C," essentially making it less potent. Pure vitamin C, Ascorbic acid (5%), makes your skin clear and radiant. “The percentage of Vitamin C needed in skincare products varies depending on the form of Vitamin C used. Pure vitamin C (aka ascorbic acid, AA) is great and all, but its lack of stability is a big challenge for the cosmetics industry. Niacinamide, also known as nicotinamide, is the active form of niacin (also known as vitamin B3 or nicotinic acid). Niacinamide is one of the vitamins that your body needs to stay healthy. The vitamin C would go first and I would wait at least 20-30 min after the vit C to use the niacinamide to avoid a niacin flush. Niacinamide (Vitamin B3) is indicated to reduce the appearance of skin blemishes and congestion. Vitamin C and Niacinamide are the Britney and Xtina of skincare. I'm currently looking into a Vitamin C serum, but I use Niacinamide in several of my products. It can enter the blood–brain barrier (BBB) easily, is nonaddictive, and is devoid of the flush effect of niacin form of vitamin B3. This is what causes the flushing and tingling sensation. TL;DR we don't know for sure but there is a good chance they are safe to use together. First, it protects your heart by reducing the amount of bad cholesterol (LDL) in your body. According to [this article] (http://kindofstephen.com/can-you-use-niacinamide-and-vitamin-c-ascorbic/) mixing Vitamin C and Niacinamide is a low risk, virtually not bother worrying about. Niacinamide is a form of vitamin B-3. Niacinamide Mechanism of Action. If you are interested, consider reading an older r/SCA discussion about the article you linked. They are both soluble in water, which means that your body will simply get rid of the excess through urine, and will not store it. In general, this topic seems to not have much research done on it recently. Now this ingredient loves action – think of ascorbic acid like Lara Croft, fighting off ageing, dull skin tone, fine lines and more like your life depended on it. Vitamin B3 is a naturally-occurring vitamin found in foods like yeast, meat, fish, milk, eggs, beans, and green vegetables. Thanks! Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Niacinamide is a relatively new ingredient on the skincare scene. Take Niacinamide + Vitamin C: this pair makes an especially powerful combination. The incompatibility between niacinamide and Ascorbic acid has been debunked a long time ago, so I would not worry - niacinamide is naturally present in the skin, if incompatibility were real, we could never apply vitamin c at all. We’ve got the answer to this big skin care question. Rumour has it, these two skincare superstars hate each other’s guts and can’t stand working together. If you’re already using a vitamin C in serum form, it’s important to make sure your cleanser isn’t sabotaging the serum’s attempts to give you glow. Therefore it is completely fine with Niacinamide. Some niacinamide products have helped me with fading sun spots, but Vitamin C does the heavy lifting for that sort of thing. Vitamin B3occurs naturally in 2 forms: niacin (also called nicotinic acid) and niacinamide (also called nicotinamide). Vitamin C is a powerful antioxidant that helps prevent the formation of free radicals to maintain the collagen and elastin in the skin. For more skincare science, go check out his blog. Also known as vitamin B3, is used in most skincare products because it performs multiple functions. , FRSH 1. Sometimes oral niacin (taken as a vitamin) causes flushing too. If anybody knows of any, please do let us know! I've only tried the TO niacinamide serum before of niacinamide serums, but I prefer this one immensely more. If you are after the collagen effects of Vitamin C (rather than the exfoliating effects), you can combine magnesium ascorbylphosphate and niacinamide in the same product. Worst case scenario from this is a reddish face which doesnt look too sexy but the action of it is essentially harmless to the skin. The Ordinary’s Vitamin C Suspension 30% in Silicone uses the most tried and tested skin active form of vitamin C – ascorbic acid. Niacinamide is easily dissolved in water and is well-absorbed when taken by mouth. I did reach out and send him some info and supporting documents, because the sooner that myth dies the better. I’ve been pairing my Super Pure serum with The Ordinary’s Vitamin C 23% suspension with fairly good results. At a low PH they vitamin C & B3 exchange an electron and form a weak bond. Vitamin C in L-AA (acidic form) is effective at around pH 3.5. That is, the LAA will be applied at one point in time, allowed to wait for effect, and the niacinamide applied as part of moisturizer (most of its impact is moisture barrier - and it is potent). Niacin is important to the human body for many reasons. , FRSH 1. SPF 20 is not twice as protective as SPF10 – it’s about 2-3 per cent more protective. However the same PH problem exists. Vitamin B3is also a precursor to NAD phosphate (NADP), which functions as a coenzyme in oxidation-reduction reactions. We use a very stable and bioavailable form of vitamin C called sodium ascorbyl phosphate. How would I go about using Sunday Riley’s CEO and where in my routine(after oil based serums, before moisturizer etc?) You can still use both of these ingredients, however, it's important you apply them at alternate times. You might be surprised to know that it's also possible to apply your vitamin C serum and acid together, at the same time. Niacinamide is easily dissolved in water and is well-absorbed when taken by mouth. In addition, vitamin B3is involved in brain fun… A mattifying treatment that reduces shine and improves skin clarity, zinc is combined with witch hazel and willow bark and provides skin-clearing benefits while vitamin c, niacinamide and hyaluronic acid [more] [more] brighten and hydrate. Based on the available evidence, well-studied options like prescription retinoids (and sunscreen!) Mixing these two will drag the PH up for the Vit C, and down for the niacinamide, converting it to niacin. I was looking to try Inkey List Vitamin B, C, and E moisturizer, but was concerned there may be a problem using a moisturizer with vitamin C. Has anyone tried this or similar combinations? So the cream or serum must use a form of vitamin C that works well at a higher PH. Take care of your damaged skin with a refreshing Vitamin C serum. While on the surface it seems to make sense, there are several issues with it. There is a fear of using vitamin C and niacinamide together because it’s believed that they’ll cancel each other out, rendering both formulas ineffective. What the heck is going on here? Niacinamide, or vitamin B3, is a great skin-care multitasker — it can help neutralize redness, soothe breakouts, lighten up hyperpigmentation, smooth fine lines, and more. Niacinamide does not do well at ph of 3.8 which is acidic. Perfect for anyone whose skin hates oils and oily solvents! To rest your fears at least a little bit, most articles that claim that niacinamide and vitamin C can’t work together reference studies from over 40 years ago, meaning a lot more research has been done since then. share. It’s the difference between £10 and £10.20 not £10 and £20. The way niacinamide works for preventing premature aging is quite simple – this ingredient is an antioxidant that blocks the free radical damage caused by sun exposure and pollution. From my understanding this does not mean that niacinamide and vitamin C cancel each other out or interfere with each other. So make sure to really wipe your face off. Residue left over by cleansing oils creates a barrier preventing water-soluble vitamin C from penetrating the skin. I got this info from Stratia customer support but it’s all over reddit and science based skincare blogs if you dig a bit. Thanks! RELATED READ: 3 Reasons to Consider Adding B3 (Niacinamide) to Your Skincare Routine Now, the million dollar question: Can you mix vitamin C and niacinamide? Vitamin C in L-AA (acidic form) is effective at around pH 3.5. As a chemist, I also recommend using acids (L-ascorbic, AHA’s and BHA’s ) in the morning and retinol (such as Ultimate A) and niacinamide at night.. Our latest vitamin C serum, SupremaC+, has been formulated at a skin-friendly pH of around 5.5.This is not considered acidic … Benefits of Vitamin C: Vitamin C has an excellent safety profile. PS. I combine Nia and Tetra C all the time by means of product layering. Niacin and niacinamide are two different forms of Vitamin B3. or any other outlooks on the mix. The vitamin C that conflicts with niacinamide is L-Ascorbic Acid, because to effective it requires a PH around 3-3.5 (acidic), while niacinamide requires a PH above 5. L-Ascorbic Acid absorbs best at pHs under 3 - at neutral pHs it has almost no absorption. Challenge is, ain’t nobody who can hold up all that energy. Niacinamide is a skincare ingredient worthy of your attention and your skin will love you for using it. Niacinamide is a water-soluble form of vitamin B3 that boasts a wide array of skin benefits. They never explain their reasoning behind it, and so while it could very well be the results of their research, it also could be "better safe than sorry because we don't know" or even a marketing technique for people who are familiar with the whole vitamin C and niacinamide issues and would be glad seeing a skincare company addressing it. The serum adds glow to your glow with vitamin C, improves the skin texture, and brightens the complexion. You can still use both of these ingredients, however, it's important you apply them at alternate times. But, when you peek behind the curtain, you’ll see them get on like a house on fire. Niacinamide, also known as nicotinamide, is the active form of niacin (also known as vitamin B3 or nicotinic acid). So while there seems to be no comprehensive evidence that vitamin C and niacinamide shouldn't be used together, there are also very few sources saying that that is, in fact, safe (the article you linked is the only one I found). At the same time, stable non-acidic forms (for example, Ascorbyl Tetraisopalmitate or L-Ascorbic Acid) can be applied simultaneously. To amplify niacinamide’s brightening effects, this serum contains Dermapep, a patented peptide formula that is super effective in reducing discolorations. The pH would increase regardless of the products you apply since the skin will normalize even if you don't apply other products after, so i won't advice you to over think on that part. save. Niacinamide (Vitamin B3) Vitamin B3 is found in blood in the form of niacinamide (also known as nicotinamide). Sometimes oral niacin (taken as a vitamin) causes flushing too. Thank you for starting this discussion. He's also stated things that are very incorrect about SPF. Together at 5% B3 they really even skin tone and fade dark spots. What Stephen Alain Ko says in the article seems to make sense and I am inclined to think that vitamin C and niacinamide are okay to use together. Also, L-Ascorbic acid, once applied, stays active in the skin for 72hrs, so every other day is sufficient, if you don’t want to apply it every day. "I'm sorry you feel that way" wtf, and she has her own company. I have read not to mix Niacinamide with topical vitamin C and was not sure if this would cause an adverse effect. This causes flushing of the skin, and reduces their effectiveness. In general, Niacinamide should not be combined with very acidic (pH below 4) or alkaline (pH above 7) products. Acidic forms of vitamin C destroy Niacinamide. This is an issue with niacinamide because when niacinamide mixes with an acid it converts to nicotinic acid which in turn activates epidermal langerhans cells. Go forth! This is also true of mixing vitamin C and B3 in the same cream or serum. Niacinamide and Vitamin C [Routine Help] Routine Help. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, More posts from the SkincareAddiction community, Press J to jump to the feed. I think the only reason there's some discussion about not using them together is because niacinamide can cause flushing after using Vitamin C. We recommend you apply The Ordinary Niacinamide 10% + Zinc 1% Serum in the morning and your Vitamin C product in the evening. It also helps to repair existing damage by normalizing collagen production and blocking excess melanin formation—which means your skin will become firmer, more even-toned and more radiant. I believe this misconception is due to vitamin C (specifically L-Ascorbic acid) needing to be at a certain pH level in order to be effective-- hence the 'acid' part in LAA. Vitamin C and Niacinamide are the Britney and Xtina of skincare. I have been using TO niacinamide + zinc and love the results. Vitamin C is a powerful antioxidant, so it protects your skin from premature aging by neutralizing free radicals. This fear is only increased by the fact that vitamin C is an extremely finicky ingredient to work with, making it … Option 3: Apply Them at the Same Time. Vitamin B3is a precursor to nicotinamide adenine dinucleotide (NAD), which plays a role in the electron-transport chain and, consequently, in the synthesis of adenosine triphosphate (ATP), the body’s main storage form of energy. In their official Regiment Guide, the Ordinary suggests avoiding using vitamin C and niacinamide at the same time. One solution is to create stable derivatives that can be absorbed into the skin, convert there to AA and do all the magic AA is proven to do (which is being an antioxidant, a collagen booster, and a skin brightener). Combined with niacinamide this pH could cause the flushing. if yes -> not dead. L-Ascorbic Acid absorbs best at pHs under 3 - at neutral pHs it has almost no absorption. For instance, she completely ignores the [very small] amount of niacinamide and ascorbic acid that actually deteriorate. I've heard others saying it's very dangerous. We recommend you apply The Ordinary Niacinamide 10% + Zinc 1% Serum in the morning and your Vitamin C … Anything more than that may cause skin irritation and should be used inDiscover the amazing benefits of Niacinamide & Vitamin C. 11. My personal stance on this is that I don't have enough education in cosmetic chemistry to judge for myself and thus have to rely on others to explain everything. With that being said, because my routine doesn't include lots of steps, I can use vit C in AM and leave niacinamide for PM. It's no issue at all. We do not recommend combining Vitamin C (L-Ascorbic Acid, Ethylated L-Ascorbic Acid or Vitamin C Derivatives) with Niacinamide with Direct or Ethylated Vitamin C, and Vitamin C Derivatives due to the formation of a salt complex that has the potential to reduce the integrity of both compounds. The absorption pH is REALLY different. The result is skin that is balanced with a decreased appearance of oil and breakouts. Vichy Vitamin C serum Both the derms in the videos had high praise for the Vichy vitamin C serum ($28.50) , and so I’m super excited about it. So, I have a sense it's their marketing or possibly even the founder that writes their material. In their official Regiment Guide, the Ordinary suggests avoiding using vitamin C and niacinamide at the same time. It converts to niacin which can cause flushing redness in sensitive skin. Along with niacinamide, this potent serum contains a cocktail of antioxidants—like vitamin B5, C, E, and ferulic acid—making it the perfect first-step in your morning skincare routine. SPF is the most confusing thing ever created in skin care regulations. They don't cancel each other out or anything of that sort. The entry goes on to explain that Niacinamide is also to help repair damage from UV light and environmental pollutants. Niacinamide is one of the two forms of vitamin B3 — the other being nicotinic acid. It is primarily available in the form of liquid or gel consistency. So buying a cream or serum with bothe Vitamin C and B3 is better than just one of them but the ph of the product must be at least 5, New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, More posts from the SkincareAddiction community, Press J to jump to the feed. “There is an old study from almost 60 years ago that showed that when these two products were used together under … As I learned more about individual nutrients, magnesium replaced vitamin C at the top of the list, and has remained there ever since. 100% Upvoted. Which The Ordinary Vitamin C Should I Choose? Long story short, niacinamide hydrolyses to niacin at under around pH 4.5. A lot of times when people suggest against using vitamin C and niacinamide, they cite this article. The absorption pH is REALLY different. When I first began studying nutritional therapies in the early 1970s, vitamin C was my favorite nutrient. The fear is that this will degrade the performance of each but if the ph is higher than no problem there is no exchange and they work well together. They are not even fine in the same bottle for minutes. There’s a lot of confusion as to whether these two superstar ingredients cancel each other out when applied at the same time. Nia combined with non acidic forms of vitamin C such as Tetra = no problem. But in general, it perfectly interacts with all the ingredients. A high 10% concentration of this vitamin is supported in the formula by zinc salt of pyrrolidone carboxylic acid to balance visible aspects of sebum activity. Niacinamide—also known as vitamin B3—boasts a long list of perks. First, it features an incorrect molecular formula. There is so much contradicting information on this topic that it's really hard to find out the truth. Eva Naturals Niacinamide Vitamin B3 Serum ingredients explained: Aloe Barbadensis (Organic Aloe) Leaf Juice, Glycerin, Niacinamide (Vitamin B3), Emulsifying Wax NF, Persea Gratissima (Avocado) Oil, Phenoxyethanol, Tocopherol (Vitamin E), Azadirachta Indica (Organic Neem) Seed Oil, Rosmarinus Officinalis (Rosemary) Leaf Extract, Sodium Hyaluronate (Hyaluronic Acid), Xanthan Gum, Tetrasodium … Most highly touted moisturizers and SPF products contain high amounts of niacinamide, including 2 that I found after endless vetting, and I LOVE them (CeraVe PM Facial Lotion and Olay Regenerist Micro-Sculpting SPF 30, FYI). If you are after the collagen effects of Vitamin C (rather than the exfoliating effects), you can combine magnesium ascorbylphosphate and niacinamide in the same product. I really want to believe this, but I am not a chemist in any way and the warning on The Ordinary's website still worries me. Niacin = facial flushing and tingling. report. As a water-soluble vitamin, it won't dissolve in oil, so you'll typically find it in water-based serums. Rumour has it, these two skincare superstars hate each other’s guts and can’t stand working together. 1 comment . Yes, according to all the dermatologists and experts we consulted.. Then why all the drama about the combo? Vitamin C derivatives are the exception, as most have higher pH levels. Third, the author on Futurederm cites very old articles and doesn't go into detail about the research there. Niacinamide increases energy production within our skin cells. Among a handful of other amazing skincare ingredients such as retinol and vitamin C, niacinamide is a standout because of its versatility … It is temporary but B3 (Niacinamide) is good for rosacea (which I have) and most dermatologists sell a cream with at least 2%. They’re like a primer plus extra credit. I'm interested in how other incorporate the two, (one in AM and one in PM?) They’re fine in the same routine, they’re not fine in the same formula/bottle for months. We are all humans, of course, but still this is kind of suspicious and makes me question the credibility of the source. Product name: Skinlex 10% Niacinamide Serum, Extended version Price (range): $13.60 USD / 60 mL (2 oz.) ... Reddit cosmetic chemist Stephen Alain Ko was the first to point out they can be used together. These studies were off from the start because they used non-stabilized forms of both ingredients, whereas both ingredients are typically stabilized when used in modern formulas. Niacinamide Category: Antioxidant Best time to use: As needed to address pore size, or once daily to balance oily skin What it does: Niacinamide is a relatively new guy on the scene. In fact, using an acid right before vitamin C could actually ENHANCE your results. Among a handful of other amazing skin care ingredients such as retinol and vitamin C, niacinamide is a standout because of its versatility for almost any skin care concern and skin type. Vitamin C Niacinamide Zinc Serum. It’s a form of vitamin B-B3, to be specific. This means that in order for you to be healthy, you need a constant supply of niacinamide or its sister compound. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts, http://kindofstephen.com/can-you-use-niacinamide-and-vitamin-c-ascorbic/, also stated things that are very incorrect about SPF. It’s a myth that Niacinamide and Vitamin C products can’t be worn together, they actually are quite compatible. Combined with niacinamide this pH could cause the flushing. Ahead, top dermatologists weigh in on why this B vitamin deserves an A+ rating, and share their favorite niacinamide products. It’s also commonly found in vitamin B complex supplements – along with other B vitamins like vitamin B12. 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